Saturday, 5 June 2010

Ian Brown, Peter Hook and "pink faces in faded Stone Island"

We wrote a piece for the Guardian Guide on the forthcoming Ian Brown Platt Fields gig.

Our fee has been donated to the proper Manchester heroes at Christie Hospital.


  1. Completely agree with this, here's to not drowning in nostalgia, how seductive it may be.

  2. The problem with that article and this whole blog, in fact, is that it's all so uncutting that it's untrue. Your targets are pretty spot on but the writing is just so limp that it takes a lot a way from it. The Guardian piece just reads like it's been written by some Chorltonian 40 something who's still pissed off that he got turned away from 42nd Street one night for wearing a King Creosote t-shirt.

  3. Well, those folky south Manchester types are almost worth a whole separate blog.

    It's a shame you don't like the writing, is there a style you'd prefer? Maybe from the point of view of a 23 year old My Chemical Romance fan?

  4. I'm visiting this blog precisely because I've just read the piece in The Guardian. I have to admit, when I first turned the page to the article, my eyes hit the pictures, the design and the word 'Factory' first - and my heart sank. "Not ANOTHER article on Madchester," I thought. But seconds afterwards, I was reading the content and cheering.

    I'm not from Manchester - I'm from another big British city.

    Whenever I've visited Manchester, I've really, really liked it. What I find totally off-putting, though, is the kind of obsessive, evangelical pride in the city that so many militant Mancunians have. And the city's musical heritage, as described in the article and reappraised elsewhere countless times, is central to this.

    Sometimes it seems like Manchester has become the most self-mythologising, self-aggrandising city since Caesar's Rome. It's even more annoying than the Greeks banging on about the achievements of their ancestors or Liverpool trumpeting the Beatles - and all the more conspicuous in a nation that broadly prefers humility and self-deprecation to arrogance and braggadocio.

    It really doesn't have to be this way. A great city doesn't need to do this. If a city's good enough, it should just 'be' - and people will just get it. That's what real confidence is.

    I hope the Factory Records/Madchester generation and all the proud hangers-on realise how unattractive and counter-productive this constant misty-eyed nostalgia and self-promotion has become, and pipe down. I'd like to go back to simply liking Manchester as a city, without feeling irritated with Manchester as a 'concept'. There is more to a city than its music scene, and more to Manchester than Factory Records.

  5. Adventure Baby5 June 2010 at 13:32

    Im not craving any particular writing style, it's just I can't completely justify this blog as a.) it's just not very funny and b.) I get the impression that it's written by thirty something mature students (possibly from Slough, definitely not from Manchester) who if they were to receive an email of support from Dave Haslam they'd double drop and throw a fucking party.

  6. @jb We couldn't agree with you more.

    @adventure baby Sorry to hear it. We are all from Manchester,for the record. Anyway, Please get in touch with our subscriptions department and they'll see that you get a full refun...oh

  7. Adventure Baby5 June 2010 at 14:17

    Look. I don't want a refund Im just a bit pissed off that I'll never get back the 5 minutes of my life I lost reading your 'cutting' piece in the Guardian Guide this morning - killer closing paragraph, "ooh, we have some great venues in Manchester ... shed loads of aces things to do". I know your type and Ive seen your rejection letters from NME too. 'Cant be a journalist? Too old to be in a band? Start a blog!'

  8. For further evidence of good things happening take a look at the Factory Foundation Recordings post. It also contains people presuming whether someone is actually FROM Manchester or not, like it fucking matters.

  9. If you don't like this blog you're a dick/Clint Boon's mum

  10. Adventure baby - you've got issues.

  11. @Adventure Baby - Youve probably spent more than 5 minutes commenting on the article

  12. I live in Manchester and all I see and hear are great new bands in great new venues. All Fuc51 sees is old Manchester. Maybe Fuc51 should get out more. Maybe Fuc51 should tell us what great new stuff is going on out there instead of wallowing in the past. Maybe Fuc51 should actually stop writing anonymous articles for the London press desperate to rundown the north. Maybe Fuc51 should actually go to Fac251 and see that it's actually packed full of teenagers having a great time to new bands or modern tunes (except when The Fall played there when it was a really old crowd seeking nostalgia!). Maybe on this blog Fuc51 could suggest a new bands bill for a festival in Manchester? Go on I dare you...

  13. Funny that 'Adventure Baby' is whining so much - not a member of a failed Factory act by any chance?

  14. @Jo We live in Manchester too, and like we've said a million times before, if you're after tip-offs about new bands, you've come to the wrong blog. That aside, if you read our Mojo interview or, indeed, the piece in The Guide, you'll see we actually mention some of the good things going on in and around the city.

  15. Spot on about Acoustik Anarckhy, glad to see you highlighting them as a great night really moving things forward in the city, rather than trading on the past like everyone else. Saw Tom Hingley (ex-Inspiral Carpets) play a great headline gig at one of their nights a while back. Happy Dayz. :)

  16. Absolutely there are loads of good things going on around the city and your pointless whinging about the small portion of heritage-related stuff is just tiresome. Get over it! I don't like Ian Brown either and so instead of going to his Gig I went to the Dot to Dot festival instead...not a Hacienda stripe or pair of baggy jeans in sight and A Certain Ratio were nowhere to be seen.

  17. @Jo Re:London press. The Guardian was founded in Manchester and used to be called The Manchester Guardian.

    Just sayin

  18. God this blog is so dismal.
    It is actually the only place in Manchester where people are so steeped in the past.
    You want to get out more you sad old fool.
    Oh, and your anon status fools no-one.
    We all know who you are.

  19. @Jo and Anonymous 6 June 2010 03:16, maybe I've got this wrong but I had understood the underlying point of the FUC51 Guardian article to be, in part at least, about the way Manchester views itself and presents itself to others - rather than a critique of the current music scene in the city. The article seemed to be quite clear about this. There may still be lots going on in Manchester but that doesn't mean the Factory Records/Madchester scene isn't exerting undue influence on the city's self-image.

    Also, can it really be fair to accuse the London press of being "desperate to run down the north"? Undoubtedly there are parts of the country that 'the London press' is beastly to (try the Midlands, Wales or East Anglia for size), but Manchester is hardly one of them. The city seems to get far more and far better coverage in the national media than any of its competitors, by a considerable margin. (Compare and contrast to Birmingham; an inferior city, perhaps, but by no means entirely without merit or interest - and yet completely ignored in London.)

  20. @Jo - seeing The Fall is never a nostalgia trip

    @Turbo Belly - The Guardian may have been FROM Manchester, but it's f**ked off down south now like so many others.

  21. The saving grace, IMO, of the line-up of the festival is that at least most likely some of those musicians will be performing newer songs (I don't think even Ian Brown would have his setlist completely of Roses songs), so at least the music wouldn't be completely retro.


  23. Ha, even though you've posted anonymously above Elliott I can spot your dick-handed internet parlance anywhere.

  24. @adventurebaby

    Seriously. You want a refund?! How about we call it quits for the amount of time ANYONE spent reading the dog shit where you basically spent 500+ words banging on about THE DAY YOU WENT TO WHITBY:

    Holy shit. What EARTH SHATTERING stuff.

    And to the doubters.. You should really check out the 600+ words where our intrepid misadventurebaby spends his entire Sunday afternoon admitting to everyone on Twitter that his ENTIRE PERSONA consists basically of nothing more than manipulating a fancy word for a fucking Egg Sandwich.

    In fairness, we all know you're angle: The Adventure Babies are infamous for being "the last band ever signed by Factory". That makes it provable by SCIENCE and GRAPHS: they're the SHITTEST band ever signed by Factory.

    You're living your life so far up your own pASSt that you're clearly part of the problem, not part of the solution. Your input on this blog is less than invalid.

  25. Seeing The Fall is ALWAYS a nostalgia trip....They played at Fac251 recently...your favourite venue was half filled with the oldest crowd you ever see at a Manchester gig. A real dad's crowd. Their sound has not changed in thirty years. Giving the greying fans what they want.

    Apart from that this 'elevated pub debate' is just that. A sad old man mumbling into his pint glass. Of course the London Guardian print you. They want to beat Manchester with a stick and ignore the many great young bands in the city that you ignore/don't know about. You still think The Fall is a new band!

    Let's hear your alternative to the Ian Brown gig? We dare you to tell us what new bands are going on? We dare you to tell us about all the great new nights in town? Or don't you know any! Do you stay in spending hours looking yourself up on the internet thrilled that you have managed to get only 500 'fwends' on Twitter!

  26. Exclamation marks are a bit like laughing at your own joke!

    We don't have to give you an alternative to the Ian Brown gig, that's not the point - have you even read the blog?





  28. A few things:

    1. The Fall is no nostalgia trip despite 'older people' liking them, they're always playing new material and moving forwards not back. Their continued existance does not undermine this fact.

    2. The Adventure Babies were just about the shittest Factory signing, and there were quite a few contenders for this crown. One of the reasons Factory turned shit after '88 (no one will make a movie of this period).

    3. As for 'new' Manchester bands, are there any that really matter at the moment? The best current bands come from elsewhere. This of course may change, we're waiting.

  29. I LOVE NORTHSIDE.....shit did I say that out loud !!!!!

  30. As someone who spends more time than is healthy thinking about the past, I'd like to point out that the people who are saying the Fall are some kind of nostalgia act are talking shite.

    If you think they sound the same now as when they first started, you need to get your ears syringed. They're a constantly evolving band - sorry, group - with a constantly evolving sound. Please save your vitriol for the people who deserve it.

  31. Adventure Baby8 June 2010 at 13:27

    It's so obvious that Rob Hyde is behind this blog - even though he also posts as himself (good plan, yeah). Although he's now based in London (left town cos nobody likes him) he surely is the ultimate Chorlton knob.

  32. Hi Adventure Baby - flattering, ta.
    If it helps, I have no idea who you are. You're a right tedious prickstain if your posts on here are anything to go by though. speak soon. Rob

  33. Nish clish and bang,

  34. Who the fuck is Rob Hyde?

  35. Look forward to seeing you all outside the Hardrock with your placards.

    Down with Hendrix.

  36. Everything old is shit! Logan's Run had it right!

  37. Adventure Baby9 June 2010 at 22:47

    I must protest... I posted a comment about Rob 'snide' Hyde on here and it wasnt approved. Ive never actually spoken to him. I've heard plenty of people comment that he was Chorlton's answer to Nathan Barley but other than that it was mainly negative stuff. He's the kind of late thirties fuckwit you see on a BMX in the Northern Quarter dressed 15 years his junior. Im pretty sure he lives in Shoreditch now. He used to tell people he was the the first man in Manchester to drink Absinthe and the last person to take methadrone before it was outlawed. Last seen organising 'illegal' water fights in Hyde Park. What a wanker.

  38. Adventure Baby, is this you?

    You look like a fucking penis.

  39. I read the Guardian Guide piece with interest.

    Your general hypothesis is that Mancunian music culture should stop wallowing in a nostalgia for the post-punk to Madchester era, and should look to the future, instead of being dominated by a "bloke-led, fortysomething appreciation of music from 20 years ago".

    You then cite The Unabombers as "genuinely interesting", before praising The Warehouse Project's booking policy as being "consistently strong and innovative".

    Let's just pause there for reflection.

    The Unabombers play house music (around 25 years old), techno (marginally older than house music), rap (30 years old), disco (35 years old), and funk (older). Forgive me, but I'm struggling with the idea that a pair of forty-something DJs playing music that originated in the 1980s is "genuinely interesting".

    Next up: The Warehouse Project. Let's check the line-ups for 2009 for this innovative series of events, and cherry pick a few of the big names. Justin Robertson, Eric Prydz, Goldie, Sasha & Digweed, Aphex Twin, Ronnie Size, Richie Hawtin, DJ Sneak, Fatboy Slim, the list is endless. With the exception of La Roux, I couldn't really see anyone who wasn't middle aged or male. Now I've not a problem with being middle aged and male (I am both), but the idea that TWP is somehow innovative is farcical. It's a big rave, modeled on the big raves of 20 years ago. And the music played is invariably based on dance music originating from 20 years ago.

    So basically, Manchester should stop wallowing in nostalgia for one of the most significant developments in popular music history (Factory/Hacienda/Madchester), one that was driven by mancunian culture, and start wallowing in nostalgia for US-originated house music and warehouse raves. Thanks, but I've been there, done that. Rave is all played out now, it got stupidly mainstream (Eric Prydz FFS) and all house and techno music produced in the last 10 years just retreads the work published in the previous 10 years. You Fuc51 lot are as nostalgic as the rest of them, but can't admit it.

  40. Of course you're right, good post - is nostalgia a bad thing? No - as we say in the article, everyone wants the Stones to play Satisfaction.

    Buring the past down completely is a stupid idea.

    The point of this blog (the sole point, the whole reason of being) - is railing against a particular kind of Manc nostalgia. Yes, the Unabombers play old records. Yes, everyone on at TWP isn't 20 years old and fresh out of the box. But at least they're interesting.

    Despite putting 'retro' acts on as you put it, you still can't put your finger on them.

    Whereas with everything FAC, roManctic and so on, not only can you put your finger on it you can also write 2000 words on it right off the bat. The same 2000 words. every time. It's dull. It's stifling. It's why we're here.

  41. @adventurebaby
    > I've heard plenty of people comment that he was Chorlton's answer to Nathan Barley
    > but other than that it was mainly negative stuff.

    > other than that

    Well futile.

  42. Lawrence Williams10 June 2010 at 19:55

    'RoManctic' hahahahaha. What a wanker, what an absolute wanker!!!

  43. @adventurebaby

    Posting comments slagging off someone you admit never having spoken to seems a little odd. You seem to have taken quite a strong dislike to this Hyde fellow for some reason, but I don't see how posting your negative comments here helps anyone.

  44. Peter hook reminds me of that 80's football dude in Napoleon Dynamite. If only hooky had a time machine, oh he does, fac251.

  45. @Adventure Baby

    I'm really, really confused as to how you can say that "It's so obvious that Rob Hyde is behind this blog" and yet admit that you've never spoken to him and have only a cursory idea as to who he is?

  46. This is lazy journalism. Rather than spend several weeks extensively researching his subject matter and interviewing scores of witnesses and experts and thus earning the thousands of pounds he got paid, I suspect the writer wrote this while asleep. Because I'm an expert at this sort of thing. Writing and that.

  47. I'm a 51 year-old Yank from LA (oops, there goes all my cred I reckon) chiming in here. Being from LA I think we know a thing or two about having musical histories hanging over us.

    In practice I don't see it happening over here. Someone like, say, Silversun Pickups wasn't weighed down with any "New Doors" expectations.

    I do go to see an older band on occasion when warranted, but for the most part I'm the same way I've been for over 30 years - I'm all about the new. I was lucky to see one of Section 25's last gigs before Larry Cassidy passed and then over the following months in the same venue I saw acts like LA's own Flying Lotus and Brooklyn's excellent School Of Seven Bells, just to use one example.

    In fact, one of my favorite new acts is a young Mancunian bloke - Casual Violence. Very modern twist on harder Techno. He's brilliant - check out his SoundCloud tracks/sets:

    I don't exactly see A Guy Called Gerald's shadow - or Graeme Park's, or anyone's - looming over this kid.

    I was in Manchester in 2006 and loved it. I revere its past but I don't think it should ever overshadow the present. In the end it's the kids banging out good tunes that push things forward, innit?

    I don't see why the old and the new can't coexist peacefully.